i have a monkey on a string

[the_siobhan]

I usually try to limit my Facebook use to short quips and sharing of music videos and online petitions. I just like the blog environment a lot better for having more in-depth conversations. But every once in a while I post something that generates a lot more comments than I was expecting. The "newsworthy women of 2012" post started off like that.

So I made a post on FB a few weeks back. It went like this;

Public support for alcohol prohibition in North America was largely spear-headed by women's groups who believed that it would stop men from spending the grocery money on booze and then coming home drunk and beating up their wives. Of course prohibition laws passed and incidents of domestic violence did not decline. It must have been a bitter realization for them.

I think of those women every time I hear an atheist claim that human society would feature less injustice, intolerance and violence if only we could get rid of religion.

So it did generate a lot of comments, mostly a debate about whether or not religion could be considered to be a bad influence. Which was interesting, but not really what I was going for. (Although I have to confess, I did immediately start picturing the exact same conversation happening between a group of women 150 years ago; one side presenting example after example of Good Men Who Had Gone Over To The Drink, and the other side arguing they knew plenty of people who could have a tipple without turning into a monster. But I digress.)

So anyway, saving that for a separate post. What I was really getting at was wanting to point out that taking away the things that influence people to turn into douchbags won't magically get rid of assholes. Being an asshole is one of the things that humans have evolved to be very good at.

But of course if I'm being honest it's not as simple as that either. We aren't islands, standing tall and proud in the strength of our convictions. We are influenced our entire lives by family, environment, peers, experiences, popular culture, things we read, genetics, the perceptions and expectations and treatment we get from other people.

I remember when I was a kid being absolutely incensed when my parents decided that one of my friends was a "bad influence". How dare they assume that I was so weak-minded and easily led that I couldn't be a fuck-up all on my own. But the people we surround ourselves with are both picked because they share our values and also give us the feedback that says are values are the correct ones. When I go out of my way to behave in ways that are seen as positive I get kudos from my peers. When I fuck up, I get called on it. That's what peer pressure is all about, and that's the reason that one of the most common conditions of probation is that you not hang around with your old friends. As per my previous sentence about my friends calling me on my shit, it can also be a powerful force for good - assuming we all agree on what constitutes "good", that is.

But yet some people can walk away from that. I know a ton of people who have left their family or their birth religion or changed their political affiliation because they perceived injustice in how other groups were treated. That can't be easy. I have read many stores written by people who spent time in white supremest groups, who grew up in "quiverfull" communities, who were surrounded their whole lives by a belief system and yet abandoned everything they knew in favour of what they felt was right. Hell, I once read an interview with Randall Terry's mother where she identified as a feminist. Look at how much good that did him.

So where is the line? What makes the difference between behaving a certain way because it's all you've ever known and behaving that way because it is truly a part of who you are? How does holding people accountable for their actions as individuals intersect with the acknowledgment that they are immersed in a culture that reinforces and encourages some of the worst parts of human nature?

I have my own take on the answers to those questions but I'm still mulling over how to clarify them. You take a stab at it.


(This post was brought to you by the Iron LJ Retro Challenge. It was originally posted on FB, but Axel explains what it's about here.

Comments

[the_axel]

I think you meant Randall Terry not Terry Randall.

Unless you have some objection to Australian Rugby League that I am not aware of...

[the_siobhan]

I did. I even searched for the interview without realizing I'd buggered it up.

[greylock]

An objection to ARL is perfectly acceptable, and I will support it.

[theweaselking]

I kind of like that comparison. It even holds down to the occasional religion-consumers, who use it socially because it feels good and is fun, but don't let it run their lives and who quite sensibly keep it far, far away from any significant decisions.

[greylock]

[Odd. I did not see Axel's post. Apparently I defriended him on LJ in preference to here. Must fix that].

I would love to take a stab at your questions, but I'm not entirely sure of the answers, aside from throwing my hands up and going "what's with people?".

[cris.livejournal.com]

I was raised as a rather hardcore Catholic. We used to joke that "The Reformation never sailed to the Philippines" for the form of Catholicism that we practiced was a bit ... medieval. Heavy on the mysticism and the martyrdom and the ineffable capriciousness of God. Another friend put it well, "you're religious in the way any people who live with earthquakes and volcanoes and typhoons and all other manners of unexplainable disasters can be religious."

So, yeah, those stories of people who grow up in one belief system and have to abandon it has a twinge for me. Personally, my reckoning was in high school, when a few atheist classmates got into arguing with me and made me realize that, in the end, the Bible really was just written by fallible men.

I guess that's your line. Sometimes two things you believe in contradict each other, and the way you resolve it (preferring faith over logic or familarity over new knowledge) is a reflection of who you truly are.

Everyone is a composite of multiple influences, and their identities as individuals are inextricable to the culture and circumstances that shaped them.